Accreditation looking into UNC again

[dayooper]

UNC is up for accreditation and the SAC is looking into the UNC report that they gave to the NCAA. Apparently, UNC said they wouldn’t honor the paper classes. They changed their story in their report to the NCAA. Much better explanation in the article

Link

 

[crewbear742]

So a couple of things.

1. UNC is a top University, and (except for those looking to score cheap points) no one seriously doubts the quality of its education. The probability that UNC will receive a significant sanction over this situation approaches metaphysical zero. People are not going to look askance at a degree from UNC just because of problems in its African American Studies Dept over fake courses for athletes.

2. UNC was never going to dishonor a course once it was on the Transcript because of the liability it would incur. What happened was UNCs fault. Students paid money for those courses and did the work prescribed. There are people with degrees conveyed by UNC that have those courses on their transcript. UNC wasn't going to retro-actively revoke those degrees by invalidating coursework.

3. I imagine UNC agreed to refuse to honor courses currently in process if those courses turned out to be paper courses. I doubt they ever agreed to remove courses from a transcript. And that would be the right thing to do. Think what would happen if a graduating senior suddenly had two or three electives removed due to UNCs negligence.

The students took advantage of UNCs lack of control. They didn't do anything wrong. They found an easy elective and took it. It isn't the fault of the students that UNC created this situation and the students should not be made to suffer for it.

 

[auggie22]

So a couple of things.

1. UNC is a top University, and (except for those looking to score cheap points) no one seriously doubts the quality of its education. The probability that UNC will receive a significant sanction over this situation approaches metaphysical zero. People are not going to look askance at a degree from UNC just because of problems in its African American Studies Dept over fake courses for athletes.

2. UNC was never going to dishonor a course once it was on the Transcript because of the liability it would incur. What happened was UNCs fault. Students paid money for those courses and did the work prescribed. There are people with degrees conveyed by UNC that have those courses on their transcript. UNC wasn't going to retro-actively revoke those degrees by invalidating coursework.

3. I imagine UNC agreed to refuse to honor courses currently in process if those courses turned out to be paper courses. I doubt they ever agreed to remove courses from a transcript. And that would be the right thing to do. Think what would happen if a graduating senior suddenly had two or three electives removed due to UNCs negligence.

The students took advantage of UNCs lack of control. They didn't do anything wrong. They found an easy elective and took it. It isn't the fault of the students that UNC created this situation and the students should not be made to suffer for it.

Sounds like you agree that that institution should be punished.

The problem is they are claiming these were fraudulent classes to one governing body to receive leniency, and then turning around and claiming to another governing body that these were not fraudulent classes to take advantage of a loop hole. All to avoid any meaningful sanction.

 

[crewbear742]

Sounds like you agree that that institution should be punished.

The problem is they are claiming these were fraudulent classes to one governing body to receive leniency, and then turning around and claiming to another governing body that these were not fraudulent classes to take advantage of a loop hole. All to avoid any meaningful sanction.

I am saying that there is nothing that can be done about courses that are already on a Transcript. The University is bound to honor those courses whether it wants to or not. Should the NCAA be able to take action when players maintain eligibility through fake courses? Yes, but that would require a change to the NCAA bylaws, and University Presidents will never accept it. Academic content is in their mind the sole responsibility of the University. So what does that leave? UNC isn't going to lose accreditation. There are thousands of students at UNC receiving a legitimate education. That won't be threatened by this scandal.

What should have happened in my view is that UNC should have abolished the AFAM Studies Department that caused this disaster. In addition (and assuming there is some basis in law) I would also think UNC should consider going after retired or former employees with a lawsuit. Never underestimate the corrective value of (metaphorical) heads impaled on a stick.

 

[huskypantz]

I am saying that there is nothing that can be done about courses that are already on a Transcript. The University is bound to honor those courses whether it wants to or not. Should the NCAA be able to take action when players maintain eligibility through fake courses? Yes, but that would require a change to the NCAA bylaws, and University Presidents will never accept it. Academic content is in their mind the sole responsibility of the University. So what does that leave? UNC isn't going to lose accreditation. There are thousands of students at UNC receiving a legitimate education. That won't be threatened by this scandal.

What should have happened in my view is that UNC should have abolished the AFAM Studies Department that caused this disaster. In addition (and assuming there is some basis in law) I would also think UNC should consider going after retired or former employees with a lawsuit. Never underestimate the corrective value of (metaphorical) heads impaled on a stick.

So bad stuff happened, but let's move on. Got it.

 

[upstater]

I am saying that there is nothing that can be done about courses that are already on a Transcript. The University is bound to honor those courses whether it wants to or not. Should the NCAA be able to take action when players maintain eligibility through fake courses? Yes, but that would require a change to the NCAA bylaws, and University Presidents will never accept it. Academic content is in their mind the sole responsibility of the University. So what does that leave? UNC isn't going to lose accreditation. There are thousands of students at UNC receiving a legitimate education. That won't be threatened by this scandal.

What should have happened in my view is that UNC should have abolished the AFAM Studies Department that caused this disaster. In addition (and assuming there is some basis in law) I would also think UNC should consider going after retired or former employees with a lawsuit. Never underestimate the corrective value of (metaphorical) heads impaled on a stick.

And why haven't they gone after those employees? We know the answer to that. They have been paid to keep quiet. Anyone who believes they did this of their own accord is incredibly naive. It's not how it works.

 

[The Funster]

The ACC is fast becoming a cesspool.

 

[Sky ball]

The ACC is fast becoming a cesspool.

Don't insult the Cesspool.

 

[The Funster]

Don't insult the Cesspool.

OK, the ACC is becoming a vile pit of peepee and poopy.

 

[Sky ball]

OK, the ACC is becoming a vile pit of peepee and poopy.

Hmm...still sounds like the CP

 

[Fairfield_1st]

This makes me happy. Anything that puts UNCheat in a negative light, even if it a brief light, is a good thing. I will hold out minimal hope that the accrediting agency will drag this out a bit. UNCheat lied to someone and nobody likes to be lied to.

 

[CL82]

So a couple of things.

1. UNC is a top University, and (except for those looking to score cheap points) no one seriously doubts the quality of its education. The probability that UNC will receive a significant sanction over this situation approaches metaphysical zero. People are not going to look askance at a degree from UNC just because of problems in its African American Studies Dept over fake courses for athletes.

2. UNC was never going to dishonor a course once it was on the Transcript because of the liability it would incur. What happened was UNCs fault. Students paid money for those courses and did the work prescribed. There are people with degrees conveyed by UNC that have those courses on their transcript. UNC wasn't going to retro-actively revoke those degrees by invalidating coursework.

3. I imagine UNC agreed to refuse to honor courses currently in process if those courses turned out to be paper courses. I doubt they ever agreed to remove courses from a transcript. And that would be the right thing to do. Think what would happen if a graduating senior suddenly had two or three electives removed due to UNCs negligence.

The students took advantage of UNCs lack of control. They didn't do anything wrong. They found an easy elective and took it. It isn't the fault of the students that UNC created this situation and the students should not be made to suffer for it.

Taking inconsistent positions to two different regulating agencies is enormously problematic. In essence UNC has to decide which organization it lied to.

It's decision time UNC. Athletics or academics, you can only save one. You decide.

 

[Fairfield_1st]

Taking inconsistent positions to two different regulating agencies is enormously problematic. In essence UNC has to decide which organization it lied to.
It's decision time UNC. Athletics or academics, you can only save one. You decide.

That's a great point. But my gut tells me that somehow they will continue to get away with what they did, if for no other reason than to make our double punishment for academics that much more of a throat punch.

 

[dogged1]

That's a great point. But my gut tells me that somehow they will continue to get away with what they did, if for no other reason than to make our double punishment for academics that much more of a throat punch.

So, it was Fishy that did that? And all this time I've been blaming Emmert.

 

[ramses 2.0]

SACS is not reopening it's investigation, it sounds like someone jumped the gun & reported false info, either way it will start float around the internet shortly

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Whoa Nellie, now the University of No Class, Swofford, and the ACC even paid off the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools Commission (regional accrediting body). This action approved by the NCAA and Mark Emmert.

 

[huskymedic]

UNC is up for accreditation and the SAC is looking into the UNC report that they gave to the NCAA. Apparently, UNC said they wouldn’t honor the paper classes. They changed their story in their report to the NCAA. Much better explanation in the article

Link

SACS is not reopening it's investigation, it sounds like someone jumped the gun & reported false info, either way it will start float around the internet shortly

https://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/files/2017/11/Letter-from-Belle-Wheelan.pdf

 

[Fairfield_1st]

Looks like the nail got put in the coffin. So a widespread cheating scandal that primarily affected athletes but was also used by regular students and that was investigated by 2 agencies supposedly looking out for the welfare of the student and the credibility of the school resulted in a whopping 1 year of probation. I'm dumbfounded at how this can happen. I know this was stated before, but the blueprint is set for all the schools to keep players eligible. Rob Gray got a worse punishment for playing in a church league rec game than UNCheat got for fake classes. Wow! Just wow!

 

[dogged1]

Taking inconsistent positions to two different regulating agencies is enormously problematic. In essence UNC has to decide which organization it lied to.

It's decision time UNC. Athletics or academics, you can only save one. You decide.

https://carolinacommitment.unc.edu/files/2017/11/Letter-from-Belle-Wheelan.pdf

I would have thought that CL82's post was right on target. You can't tell one story to one regulating agency and a contradictory story to a second without reopening the case to resolve the discrepancy. They lied to one or the other. Simple logic. Yet both agencies simply respond , "Case closed."

Right now the President and Chancellor of UNC must be rolling on the floor in laughter. All I can say at this point is that UNC has shown that they have a complete and utter disregard for the rules, they believe they are above them. With that attitude, they have probably covered up other violations, the kind that the FBI might uncover in their investigation of college basketball.

I can only hope so; as often stated here, Karma is a bitch.

 

[Zissou]

All I can say at this point is that UNC has shown that they have a complete and utter disregard for the rules, they believe they are above them.

Sadly, they are in fact above the rules.

 

[auggie22]

Saddest of all is that an institution with centuries of history saw fit to risk it all for a little edge in a few sports. Those of us on the outside should feel bad for the UNC alumni, living and deceased. As douchey as many of them have proven to be - they are the real victims.

 

[Vowelguy]

The students took advantage of UNCs lack of control. They didn't do anything wrong.

I agree with most of your comments, but I find these statements inconsistent.

The students took advantage of a situation, and I'm sure almost everyone would've done the same. But it was an ill-gotten benefit, and deep down, all the students know that. They absolutely should not get credit, though I fully get that doing so would expose UNC to lawsuits and it is easier/cheaper to just allow the credit.

 

[huskymedic]

News & Observer dogs on a bone...
UNC’s statements to the NCAA didn’t ‘pass the smell test,’ accreditor said