2017 Final 4 Disappointment vs. 2018 Final 4 Disappointment

[Chong-Master]

So many will say that Geno's reaction to the 2017 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment was more of "I was surprised that the team was undefeated and made it this far" vs. Geno's reaction to last night's 2018 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment, which was more of "The Team Did Not Achieve Its Goal and should have gotten to the Championship Game". But what were the differences between the 2 teams in the Semi Final losses. Kia Nurse had a better game in 2017 vs. last night. Katie Lou had a better overall game in 2017 than last night. Collier played about at the same level in last night's game vs. last season's game. Williams was outstanding last night, but was on the bench way too long (and why?). Saniya Chong's game in 2017 was much better than the performance that Crystal Dangerfield put for. Z Stevens was the big factor last night, especially in the 2nd Quarter and kept them in the game.

So why did they fall short in 2017. Well, Mississippi State simply was bigger upfront and William played out of her head AND if UCONN had Z Stevens instead of Natalie Butler (who I am a big fan of but she was a non factor in the MSS Game in 2017) MAYBE UCONN would have won. This year's team, in my opinion, game down to Geno's lack of trust to any of his bench players other than Stevens. Would the outcome of last night's game been any different if Natalie Walker had returned and you could have had a TWIN TOWER compliment coming off your bench? Until Geno can build up his bench to a point that he can have at least a solid "trusted" 7 to 8 player rotation, this program will his annual very high expectations, will continue to fall short. Quality High School players are becoming more plentiful and they are making decisions to go to other top notch D-1 Women's Programs other than UCONN. Of course, Geno and UCONN will get our fair share of good players (such as the 2 kids coming in next year), but look at the high expectations coming into this season. 2 Solid Transfer Players who were supposed to BOTH contribute immediately (while, mainly due to an unanticipated slow recovery from injury, only 1 of the 2 produced this season) and the 4 incoming so called stud freshman, Espinoza-Hunter transferred out, Walker had a up and down season, and the other 2 didn't produce much at all. And while many would say that Kyla Irwin's game certainly improved over her freshman year, it didn't get to the point where Geno would trust her in important minutes in last night's game. And Molly Bent's game stayed the same.

So how is the UCONN Women's Basketball Program set for next year. No More Williams,No More Kia, and what 'IF" Z leaves for the WNBA, then what? Allot of big questions for Geno to try to figure out. I don't think that, on paper, next year's team will be any better than the one that came into this season, but probably more like the 2016/2017 Team, that many said over-achieved.

Your thoughts?

 

[scubadog]

I have been screaming all year for Walker to get playing time. We still don't know why Espinoza - Hunter left, and probably never will. But MS grabbed her up right away. Coombs is recovering from a medical issue, but was never prepared to help in a FF situation . Irwin and Bent are not skilled enough for meaningful games. We have been spoiled for a long time as fans, and I think we really have to be more " realistic " about our actual player talent, and coaching philosophy . I know I will be. The exact same outcome two years in a row is more than a coincidence.

 

[Mainiac]

 

[bballnut90]

So many will say that Geno's reaction to the 2017 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment was more of "I was surprised that the team was undefeated and made it this far" vs. Geno's reaction to last night's 2018 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment, which was more of "The Team Did Not Achieve Its Goal and should have gotten to the Championship Game". But what were the differences between the 2 teams in the Semi Final losses. Kia Nurse had a better game in 2017 vs. last night. Katie Lou had a better overall game in 2017 than last night. Collier played about at the same level in last night's game vs. last season's game. Williams was outstanding last night, but was on the bench way too long (and why?). Saniya Chong's game in 2017 was much better than the performance that Crystal Dangerfield put for. Z Stevens was the big factor last night, especially in the 2nd Quarter and kept them in the game.

So why did they fall short in 2017. Well, Mississippi State simply was bigger upfront and William played out of her head AND if UCONN had Z Stevens instead of Natalie Butler (who I am a big fan of but she was a non factor in the MSS Game in 2017) MAYBE UCONN would have won. This year's team, in my opinion, game down to Geno's lack of trust to any of his bench players other than Stevens. Would the outcome of last night's game been any different if Natalie Walker had returned and you could have had a TWIN TOWER compliment coming off your bench? Until Geno can build up his bench to a point that he can have at least a solid "trusted" 7 to 8 player rotation, this program will his annual very high expectations, will continue to fall short. Quality High School players are becoming more plentiful and they are making decisions to go to other top notch D-1 Women's Programs other than UCONN. Of course, Geno and UCONN will get our fair share of good players (such as the 2 kids coming in next year), but look at the high expectations coming into this season. 2 Solid Transfer Players who were supposed to BOTH contribute immediately (while, mainly due to an unanticipated slow recovery from injury, only 1 of the 2 produced this season) and the 4 incoming so called stud freshman, Espinoza-Hunter transferred out, Walker had a up and down season, and the other 2 didn't produce much at all. And while many would say that Kyla Irwin's came certainly improved over her freshman year, it didn't get to the point where Geno would trust her in important minutes in last night's game. And Molly Bent's game stayed the same.

So how is the UCONN Women's Basketball Program set for next year. No More Williams,No More Kia, and what 'IF" Z leaves for the WNBA, then what? Allot of big questions for Geno to try to figure out. I don't think that, on paper, next year's team will be any better than the one that came into this season, but probably more like the 2016/2017 Team, that many said over-achieved.

Your thoughts?

I'll respond to this in chunks:

Last year's win felt like a fluke. Last night's didn't. I didn't have the impression that UCONN was a far superior team to ND this year, where I thought UCONN was much better than Mississippi State last season. Two great teams battled last night and ND came out on top, while last year Mississippi State pulled off a miracle. I think other teams are catching up to UCONN (or have caught up to UCONN).

In terms of individual player performance, everyone last year just seemed off with the exception of Gabby and Lou in stretches. This year Nurse and Dangerfield struggled (yet came up huge in the clutch) but the rest of the starters were solid. Z was fantastic. It wasn't a poor showing from UCONN by any means--49% from the floor, 20 assists, and you won the rebounding battle--but the difference was ND really attacked UCONN and won a lot of the hustle plays.


On a team level, last night was a much faster game than last season's Mississippi State game. Notre Dame's offense was much smoother than Mississippi State's, and they had better playmakers in Arike and Jackie. The biggest downfall for UCONN was leaving Z on the bench for too much of the 3rd and ND got right back into it and played aggressively the rest of the way. In the 2nd quarter, ND couldn't get anything going and struggled stopping whatever UCONN wanted to do. ND took full advantage when Z was out in the 3rd and were able to get back into it and played more confidently the rest of the way.

Last year Mississippi State played with a lot more confidence while UCONN played with something to lose. I didn't see UCONN playing to lose last night, but they finally played a team who could execute against their defense. No one on ND had a significant advantage in height or in athleticism, but Arike played much better this time and didn't settle for bad shots, and UCONN gave too much space to Young early which got her going. Having a creative post player like Shepard was also huge.

I don't think Butler would have many any difference tonight. She put up her big numbers against poor competition and likely wouldn't have the same level of confidence in herself playing on UCONN IMO.

The lack of bench production could have been a factor, I'm surprised Geno didn't at least give Walker a shot after her good performance against ND in December. Curious to see how players develop in the offseason. Most players make a huge jump from their freshman to sophomore seasons at UCONN, so we'll see if Walker/Coombs/Gordon can make an impact next year. Same with Camara. I don't see Bent or Irwin ever being regular rotation players TBH. UCONN's success next year hinges on the development of these players, plus the impact that incoming recruits can have.

The core you have coming back though, is fantastic. Collier is a 2x AA, KLS will be a big POY candidate, Dangerfield is one of the better returning PGs in the country, and Stevens has huge upside still. I don't think UCONN is going to be head and shoulders better than everyone next year like I thought they'd be this year, but UCONN will still be the #1 team. If Notre Dame wins on Sunday, they may get the preseason #1 ranking, but we'll see. Both teams will be loaded though, that's for sure.

 

[npignatjr]

Over achieved in 2017, but under achieved in FF, 2018 expected more but the seniors while good never advanced to great offensive players. Crystal has to get much better both defensively and as a passer, leader in assists were forwards, she often was sat down like last night because of these issues. Last year thought they played badly and lost, last night played better but to overcome 15 more made free throws, made the other weaknesses almost impossible to overcome

 

[Chong-Master]

Comparisons in the NCAA Women's Semi Final Game - Who was better

A) 2017 KLS vs. 2018 KLS - Who was better in that game
B) 2017 Nurse vs. 2018 Nurse - Who was better in that game
C) 2017 Collier vs. 2018 Collier - Who was better in that game
D) 2017 Williams vs. 2018 Williams - Who was better in that game
E) 2017 Chong vs. 2018 Dangerfield - Who was better in that game
F) 2017 Bench (Dangerfield, Butler, Irvin, Bent) vs. 2018 Bench (Stevens, Walker, Irvin, Bent, Coombs, Camara)

My answers are:

A) 2017 KLS
B) 2017 Nurse
C) 2018 Collier
D) 2018 Williams
E) 2017 Chong
F) 2018 Bench

 

[bbballfan23]

So many will say that Geno's reaction to the 2017 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment was more of "I was surprised that the team was undefeated and made it this far" vs. Geno's reaction to last night's 2018 UCONN Final 4 Disappointment, which was more of "The Team Did Not Achieve Its Goal and should have gotten to the Championship Game". But what were the differences between the 2 teams in the Semi Final losses. Kia Nurse had a better game in 2017 vs. last night. Katie Lou had a better overall game in 2017 than last night. Collier played about at the same level in last night's game vs. last season's game. Williams was outstanding last night, but was on the bench way too long (and why?). Saniya Chong's game in 2017 was much better than the performance that Crystal Dangerfield put for. Z Stevens was the big factor last night, especially in the 2nd Quarter and kept them in the game.

So why did they fall short in 2017. Well, Mississippi State simply was bigger upfront and William played out of her head AND if UCONN had Z Stevens instead of Natalie Butler (who I am a big fan of but she was a non factor in the MSS Game in 2017) MAYBE UCONN would have won. This year's team, in my opinion, game down to Geno's lack of trust to any of his bench players other than Stevens. Would the outcome of last night's game been any different if Natalie Walker had returned and you could have had a TWIN TOWER compliment coming off your bench? Until Geno can build up his bench to a point that he can have at least a solid "trusted" 7 to 8 player rotation, this program will his annual very high expectations, will continue to fall short. Quality High School players are becoming more plentiful and they are making decisions to go to other top notch D-1 Women's Programs other than UCONN. Of course, Geno and UCONN will get our fair share of good players (such as the 2 kids coming in next year), but look at the high expectations coming into this season. 2 Solid Transfer Players who were supposed to BOTH contribute immediately (while, mainly due to an unanticipated slow recovery from injury, only 1 of the 2 produced this season) and the 4 incoming so called stud freshman, Espinoza-Hunter transferred out, Walker had a up and down season, and the other 2 didn't produce much at all. And while many would say that Kyla Irwin's game certainly improved over her freshman year, it didn't get to the point where Geno would trust her in important minutes in last night's game. And Molly Bent's game stayed the same.

So how is the UCONN Women's Basketball Program set for next year. No More Williams,No More Kia, and what 'IF" Z leaves for the WNBA, then what? Allot of big questions for Geno to try to figure out. I don't think that, on paper, next year's team will be any better than the one that came into this season, but probably more like the 2016/2017 Team, that many said over-achieved.

Your thoughts?

Collier had 24 last night. I thought she was the only one that lived up to her billing. She had only 11 in last years final four. She is the only reason that game went to 2 overtime’s. The play should have been ran to her instead now of Gabby. That fadeaway is her bread & butter but I’m sure it was designed for gabby to go at the rim but you just knew it wasn’t going to be that easy.

 

[rt bb fan]

Unfortunately poor shooting by Kia and Crystal probably contributed to our loss.

 

[Chong-Master]

Kia played well defensively, but did not have a good all around game. And other than that key 3 pointer late in the game, Crystal Dangerfield looked totally outmatch throughout the entire game. Very disappointing performance from her, considering how well she had come from last season.

 

[cohenzone]

Their guards outplayed our guards. By a lot.

GA interesting use of Stevens and non-use of Walker (ND hurt us badly on 2nd and 3rd chances at key moments and both those kids rebound). But who does he sit? In the second half they defended KLS very well and her tentativeness on D with her foul situation didn’t help. Maybe that’s where Walker might have helped.

The idea that this team underachieved strikes me as ludicrous. How much more can a team achieve than being unbeaten? The program has lost 2 games in 2 years. Both in the national semi final. Both in OT. We do die hard Disappointing? Of course. Disrespectful of the other team? A bit. Spoiled rotten fans? Well, Geno has created a monster.

I don’t think lack of league competition versus the Big East days is a major problem in these tournament losses because it’s not like we were run off the floor. But we definitely had several teams that pushed us in ND, Louisville, Rutgers, and occasionally DePaul, St John’s, USF, Syracuse and West Virginia. The AAC has a loooong way to go.

 

[BostonCanuck]

We were a better team this year, and we played better last night than we did in last year's semi final. Unfortunately for us, Notre Dame played better than Mississippi State as well. And we went on to lose in exactly the same manner, with some of the very same weaknesses being contributing factors.

Last year's loss was the kind of event that can make you stronger, as a player and as a team. This year's loss only stinks. As Geno said last night, I don't need to learn the same sh#! two years in a row.

 

[CocoHusky]

Comparisons in the NCAA Women's Semi Final Game - Who was better

A) 2017 KLS vs. 2018 KLS - Who was better in that game
B) 2017 Nurse vs. 2018 Nurse - Who was better in that game
C) 2017 Collier vs. 2018 Collier - Who was better in that game
D) 2017 Williams vs. 2018 Williams - Who was better in that game
E) 2017 Chong vs. 2018 Dangerfield - Who was better in that game
F) 2017 Bench (Dangerfield, Butler, Irvin, Bent) vs. 2018 Bench (Stevens, Walker, Irvin, Bent, Coombs, Camara)

My answers are:

A) 2017 KLS
B) 2017 Nurse
C) 2018 Collier
D) 2018 Williams
E) 2017 Chong
F) 2018 Bench

Comparisons in the NCAA Women's Semi Final Game - Who was better

A) 2017 KLS vs. 2018 KLS - Who was better in that game
B) 2017 Nurse vs. 2018 Nurse - Who was better in that game
C) 2017 Collier vs. 2018 Collier - Who was better in that game
D) 2017 Williams vs. 2018 Williams - Who was better in that game
E) 2017 Chong vs. 2018 Dangerfield - Who was better in that game
F) 2017 Bench (Dangerfield, Butler, Irvin, Bent) vs. 2018 Bench (Stevens, Walker, Irvin, Bent, Coombs, Camara)

My answers are:

A) 2017 KLS
B) 2017 Nurse
C) 2018 Collier
D) 2018 Williams
E) 2017 Chong
F) 2018 Bench

Shocking that "Chong Master" would think Senior Saniya was better than Freshmen Crystal Dangerfield.

 

[Chong-Master]

Shocking that "Chong Master" would think Senior Saniya was better than Freshmen Crystal Dangerfield.

Yes, shocking indeed, considering looking at the comparison of statistics from Dangerfield's game last night vs. Saniya's game against MSS. (Truth lies in the numbers)

 

[CocoHusky]

Yes, shocking indeed, considering looking at the comparison of statistics from Dangerfield's game last night vs. Saniya's game against MSS. (Truth lies in the numbers)

Lies so often come with the intrepretation of those numbers.
For example:

• Freshmen Saniya Chong played a total of 2 minutes in her first Final Four.
• Sophmore Saniya Chong played a total of 2 minutes in her second Final Four
• Crystal Dangerfield (as I'm sure you know-maybe not) did a little better than this.

 

[Chong-Master]

Lies so often come with the intrepretation of those numbers.
For example:

• Freshmen Saniya Chong played a total of 2 minutes in her first Final Four.
• Sophmore Saniya Chong played a total of 2 minutes in her second Final Four
• Crystal Dangerfield (as I'm sure you know-maybe not) did a little better than this.

with MUCH respect CocoHusky, I was referring to Saniya Chong's 2017 Semi Final Game against MSS vs. Crystal Dangerfield's 2018 Semi Final Game against ND, and not a comparison of Saniya's Freshman or Sophomore Year (Now, back to the books my good friend ! - LOL)

 

[CocoHusky]

with MUCH respect CocoHusky, I was referring to Saniya Chong's 2017 Semi Final Game against MSS vs. Crystal Dangerfield's 2018 Semi Final Game against ND (Now, back to the books my good friend ! - LOL)

As was I. Mississippi State was Crystal's first FF and ND was her second. But I see why you would want to compare Saniya's 4th FF to Crystal's 1st- no other comparison would favor Saniya=numbers interpretation lie.

 

[Chong-Master]

As was I. Mississippi State was Crystal's first FF and ND was her second. But I see why you would want to compare Saniya's 4th FF to Crystal's 1st- no other comparison would favor Saniya=numbers interpretation lie.

Come on Coco - If you want to really compare, in 2017, it was Saniya's FIRST STARTING opportunity with the team, in a Semi Final Game (vs. MSS), and in 2018 was Crystal's FIRST STARTING opportunity with the team in a Semi Final Game (vs. ND).

So now, I await you come back on this one (LOL)

 

[CocoHusky]

Come on Coco - If you want to really compare, in 2017, it was Saniya's FIRST STARTING opportunity with the team, in a Semi Final Game (vs. MSS), and in 2018 was Crystal's FIRST STARTING opportunity with the team in a Semi Final Game (vs. ND).

So now, I await you come back on this one (LOL)

Come on nothing. Saniya earned her first opportunity to start in FF when she was a senior. Crystal earned her first starting opportunity as a sophmore. I think seniors are supposed to play better than sophomores? Unless you thought it was Geno holding back Saniya for all that time or have you moved on from that lie also?

 

[Chong-Master]

Come on nothing. Saniya earned her first opportunity to start in FF when she was a senior. Crystal earned her first starting opportunity as a sophmore. I think seniors are supposed to play better than sophomores? Unless you thought it was Geno holding back Saniya for all that time or have you moved on from that lie also?

 

[Chong-Master]

Look, this is supposed to be a friendly site. Calling me out for so called lies is totally unnecessary. I get it that your upset over the loss, so am I , am many others. Please remember that for some of those early years, Chong was playing behind Mo Jefferson. I've never "attacked you" on here, olease don't make it personal back on me. Keep it civil

 

[CocoHusky]

Look, this is supposed to be a friendly site. Calling me out for so called lies is totally unnecessary. I get it that your upset over the loss, so am I , am many others. Please remember that for some of those early years, Chong was playing behind Mo Jefferson. I've never "attacked you" on here, olease don't make it personal back on me. Keep it civil

The lie is bolded for your edification.

If this team had the quality "Extremely Strong" Bench Depth, that Geno could feel comfortable in using, like he will next season, this game could have been a different story. If you look back to the recruiting classes in the past, the year that Saniya Chong was recruited, she was the only one in this year's class recruited.

 

[Chong-Master]

The lie is bolded for your edification.

Well Happy Easter to you too CocoHusky. Peace on Earth to all

 

[CocoHusky]

Well Happy Easter to you too CocoHusky. Peace on Earth to all

Thank you, Happy Easter to you also.

 

[Cheddie]

I have been screaming all year for Walker to get playing time. We still don't know why Espinoza - Hunter left, and probably never will. But MS grabbed her up right away. Coombs is recovering from a medical issue, but was never prepared to help in a FF situation . Irwin and Bent are not skilled enough for meaningful games. We have been spoiled for a long time as fans, and I think we really have to be more " realistic " about our actual player talent, and coaching philosophy . I know I will be. The exact same outcome two years in a row is more than a coincidence.

Unless one is in practice everyday, it's hard to say Megan (and others) deserved more court time. Beyond Geno's insistence on practice performance meriting game time (which should be a terrific motivator), it then becomes a question of whether Megan helps the team in games (especially tournament games) more than the player she replaces. And that's mostly been no.
With a year's experience and a summer that should be better focused on what she now realizes needs improvement, I expect a very different and much more effective Megan next year.