Same old song and dance. If UConn was valuable then... | Page 3 | The Boneyard

Same old song and dance. If UConn was valuable then...

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Susan unbuttoned the top button early on in the process?

(Since some people can't recognize a joke if it slapped them across the face, THAT'S A JOKE)

People recognize that it's a joke. Something being a joke doesn't insulate you from criticism over the fact that it's demeaning and inappropriate.
 

MattMang23

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People recognize that it's a joke. Something being a joke doesn't insulate you from criticism over the fact that it's demeaning and inappropriate.

Totally true. I have no problem if people more PC than I think a little less of me.

However, in the name of making the joke to get a rise out of people, and not actually because I think it's funny (it's not that funny but it fit well in context and tends to be overused here) I will delete my post.
 
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UConn was the victim of a LOT of bad luck and circumstance, as well as bad decision making by others, and bad decision making on its own part.

Unlucky circumstance:
- We get dinged for "not selling Fiesta Bowl tickets" when in reality it just so happened that this was the time the Fiesta organizers flooded the secondary market with cheap tickets by making National Championship game buyers buy a ticket for the Fiesta Bowl as well. Thus UConn (and OU) fans rightfully bought tickets on Stubhub for 1/4 face value instead of going through UConn. Also, Stanford getting sent to the Orange Bowl instead of us made for coast to coast travel for our fans.
- BC blackballed us in ACC expansion #1, and the rest of the league saw Pitt as a reasonable option instead of us so none of them put up a fight to make the choice SU/UConn instead of SU/Pitt. To the rest of the league that was neither here nor there, and thus BC's blackball stood.
- The Big 12 takes WVU instead of UL, or instead of both of them. This leads to the next point.
- Louisville happened to get hot at the right time before ACC expansion #2 and we were in the P era, as well as the LOL YUKON SOLD NO BOWL TICKETZ media stories. All the while ACC football was in a major downswing and in need of a better football school, thus FSU and Clemson could override the North Carolina schools who wanted us by pushing for UL and their perceived better value. Of course UL's basketball was strong enough to allow the North Carolina schools to look the other way on their piss poor academics. If the Kragthorpe era happens two years after it did and if the P era happens two years after it did, if the UL hooker scandal happens (or is finally discovered) two years before it did, there's an incredibly good chance we're in the ACC right now. BC did not have the support to blackball us in 2012. Also, if UL is in the Big 12, there's a strong case to be made that we'd get an invite over WVU, or they potentially could already be elsewhere, in the SEC or as another B12 addition.
- The Pac expansion into the Big 12 fails. If the Pac took their Big 12 contingent of Texas, Tech, OU, and OK State, A&M and Mizzou likely end up in the SEC as they are, and the Big East FB schools are able to scoop up or merge with KU, K-State, ISU, and Baylor. This would leave a Big East football conference of UConn, Cincinnati, USF, WVU, UL, TCU, and the four B12 teams. Maybe UL still goes to the ACC, but that conference is absolutely able to break away from the Catholic BB schools and able to survive on its own as a strong football conference and a very strong basketball conference and would be one of the current P5 leagues. Why the Big East sent flowers to the Big 12 when the Pac deal fell through is beyond me, that deal would've SAVED the Big East, not destroyed it.

Bad decisions by others:
- Delany goes for Rutgers instead of us. Yes, they're in the AAU, but there is absolutely no on-field or TV viewership metric that supports RU's invitation over us. Not to mention the PR disasters that have come out of the football and basketball programs and the AD's office. RU has been nothing short of an unmitigated disaster for the B1G from a competition and PR standpoint. That's why you've seen numerous postings from other B1G bloggers at schools including IU and Ohio State positing the idea that UConn should've been selected instead of RU. This was a colossal error on the B1G's part, and at some level I think they know it.

Bad decisions by UConn:
- P. Duh. An absolutely disastrous hire by UConn at the worst possible time.
- Failing to value attendance at football games and allowing the numbers to dwindle without much response, thus furthering the narrative that no one shows up to our football games.
- I don't know how much difference it would've made with the upswell of the southern ACC football schools wanting a football team rather than "another" basketball school, but UConn's monitoring of the UL/UConn decision by the ACC in 2012 was at the very least bad from a PR perspective. The confluence of events that led to the UL decision may have been out of our hands by that point, but the public image of what Warde and Herbst did during that time was not good.
- No matter how many of you don't want to hear it, the perception is that since our football team does not play on campus, we're somehow second rate. Right or wrong, it is what it is.
- Of course, not moving to FBS football sooner. That's the underlying issue behind everything. If we'd upgraded sooner and began the process sooner, it's highly unlikely we're in the AAC right now.

I'm probably forgetting what other things happened, but these are most of them. We're not in a P5 league right now for all of these reasons.
 

Fairfield_1st

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Next time a goober is wrong on the internet, just let it go.
Normally I can. I read all the twitteratti posts on the CR threads and rarely respond. This one line is my CR kryptonite. It burns me up to no end. My only saving grace is that the s that spew it aren't the decision makers, but it still pisses me off.
 
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The collegiate athletics landscape is evolving based on markets. Go to football games (as painful as they are to watch right now). Simple. It's not as if it's 40 home games in the NHL or NBA.
 
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Brass nailed it with these two.
- No matter how many of you don't want to hear it, the perception is that since our football team does not play on campus, we're somehow second rate. Right or wrong, it is what it is.
- Of course, not moving to FBS football sooner. That's the underlying issue behind everything. If we'd upgraded sooner and began the process sooner, it's highly unlikely we're in the AAC right now.


Had UConn built a stadium on campus and moved from FCS to FBS much earlier we would not be having this situation. Not a whole lot that can be done about either of those at this point but when you look at it UConn is trying to become the youngest football program in the p-5. There is not a another football program similar in age to UConn anywhere in the p-5 that I am aware of. That is one heck of a challenge.

Another thing to keep in mind is how value of a school is much different from conference to conference as Rutgers has much value to the B1G but is pretty much worthless to the Big 12. The Big 12 does not have a network to charge subscribers in the state so performance/TV ratings are much more important. I think that bodes well for UConn when it comes to the Big 12. Schools with actual fans will always be valuable no matter how the delivery of live sports evolves. The days of charging every person in NJ for channels they don't watch is going to come to an end.
 
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I haven't even read all the comments because the thesis is so dumb. If Purdue or WF or Washington State is in the P5 then we "deserve" to be P5 just the same. It's nothing more than bad luck mixed with geography.
 
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How early were we considering moving to D1-A? Like when did the rumblings start?
 
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UConn was the victim of a LOT of bad luck and circumstance, as well as bad decision making by others, and bad decision making on its own part.

Unlucky circumstance:
- We get dinged for "not selling Fiesta Bowl tickets" when in reality it just so happened that this was the time the Fiesta organizers flooded the secondary market with cheap tickets by making National Championship game buyers buy a ticket for the Fiesta Bowl as well. Thus UConn (and OU) fans rightfully bought tickets on Stubhub for 1/4 face value instead of going through UConn. Also, Stanford getting sent to the Orange Bowl instead of us made for coast to coast travel for our fans.
- BC blackballed us in ACC expansion #1, and the rest of the league saw Pitt as a reasonable option instead of us so none of them put up a fight to make the choice SU/UConn instead of SU/Pitt. To the rest of the league that was neither here nor there, and thus BC's blackball stood.
- The Big 12 takes WVU instead of UL, or instead of both of them. This leads to the next point.
- Louisville happened to get hot at the right time before ACC expansion #2 and we were in the P era, as well as the LOL YUKON SOLD NO BOWL TICKETZ media stories. All the while ACC football was in a major downswing and in need of a better football school, thus FSU and Clemson could override the North Carolina schools who wanted us by pushing for UL and their perceived better value. Of course UL's basketball was strong enough to allow the North Carolina schools to look the other way on their piss poor academics. If the Kragthorpe era happens two years after it did and if the P era happens two years after it did, if the UL hooker scandal happens (or is finally discovered) two years before it did, there's an incredibly good chance we're in the ACC right now. BC did not have the support to blackball us in 2012. Also, if UL is in the Big 12, there's a strong case to be made that we'd get an invite over WVU, or they potentially could already be elsewhere, in the SEC or as another B12 addition.
- The Pac expansion into the Big 12 fails. If the Pac took their Big 12 contingent of Texas, Tech, OU, and OK State, A&M and Mizzou likely end up in the SEC as they are, and the Big East FB schools are able to scoop up or merge with KU, K-State, ISU, and Baylor. This would leave a Big East football conference of UConn, Cincinnati, USF, WVU, UL, TCU, and the four B12 teams. Maybe UL still goes to the ACC, but that conference is absolutely able to break away from the Catholic BB schools and able to survive on its own as a strong football conference and a very strong basketball conference and would be one of the current P5 leagues. Why the Big East sent flowers to the Big 12 when the Pac deal fell through is beyond me, that deal would've SAVED the Big East, not destroyed it.

Bad decisions by others:
- Delany goes for Rutgers instead of us. Yes, they're in the AAU, but there is absolutely no on-field or TV viewership metric that supports RU's invitation over us. Not to mention the PR disasters that have come out of the football and basketball programs and the AD's office. RU has been nothing short of an unmitigated disaster for the B1G from a competition and PR standpoint. That's why you've seen numerous postings from other B1G bloggers at schools including IU and Ohio State positing the idea that UConn should've been selected instead of RU. This was a colossal error on the B1G's part, and at some level I think they know it.

Bad decisions by UConn:
- P. Duh. An absolutely disastrous hire by UConn at the worst possible time.
- Failing to value attendance at football games and allowing the numbers to dwindle without much response, thus furthering the narrative that no one shows up to our football games.
- I don't know how much difference it would've made with the upswell of the southern ACC football schools wanting a football team rather than "another" basketball school, but UConn's monitoring of the UL/UConn decision by the ACC in 2012 was at the very least bad from a PR perspective. The confluence of events that led to the UL decision may have been out of our hands by that point, but the public image of what Warde and Herbst did during that time was not good.
- No matter how many of you don't want to hear it, the perception is that since our football team does not play on campus, we're somehow second rate. Right or wrong, it is what it is.
- Of course, not moving to FBS football sooner. That's the underlying issue behind everything. If we'd upgraded sooner and began the process sooner, it's highly unlikely we're in the AAC right now.

I'm probably forgetting what other things happened, but these are most of them. We're not in a P5 league right now for all of these reasons.
Your forgetting that Jim Calhoun retired at a time we were facing suspension on bogus grounds. The narrative was UConn basketball was Jim Calhoun and our program was dead. Thats a narrative that is actually believed by the gullible on this board.
The fact that the other Big East schools were pretty much regional as well escapes the discussion. The Big East and ESPN gave them a national stage and to UConn's credit we took advantage of the opportunity
 
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Your forgetting that Jim Calhoun retired at a time we were facing suspension on bogus grounds. The narrative was UConn basketball was Jim Calhoun and our program was dead. Thats a narrative that is actually believed by the gullible on this board.
The fact that the other Big East schools were pretty much regional as well escapes the discussion. The Big East and ESPN gave them a national stage and to UConn's credit we took advantage of the opportunity
Yeah, that was a part of it but I don't think it played an enormous role in the Louisville decision in the fall of 2012. That was so heavily predicated on football that P and the lack of success of the program post-Fiesta was far, far more important.
 

HuskyHawk

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Brass nailed it with these two.
- No matter how many of you don't want to hear it, the perception is that since our football team does not play on campus, we're somehow second rate. Right or wrong, it is what it is.
- Of course, not moving to FBS football sooner. That's the underlying issue behind everything. If we'd upgraded sooner and began the process sooner, it's highly unlikely we're in the AAC right now.


Had UConn built a stadium on campus and moved from FCS to FBS much earlier we would not be having this situation. Not a whole lot that can be done about either of those at this point but when you look at it UConn is trying to become the youngest football program in the p-5. There is not a another football program similar in age to UConn anywhere in the p-5 that I am aware of. That is one heck of a challenge.

Another thing to keep in mind is how value of a school is much different from conference to conference as Rutgers has much value to the B1G but is pretty much worthless to the Big 12. The Big 12 does not have a network to charge subscribers in the state so performance/TV ratings are much more important. I think that bodes well for UConn when it comes to the Big 12. Schools with actual fans will always be valuable no matter how the delivery of live sports evolves. The days of charging every person in NJ for channels they don't watch is going to come to an end.

So UCLA isn't P5 worthy? Miami? Washington or Oregon? (technically off campus in both cases). Pitt? Baylor? USCe? I think it was a mistake to build the Rent off campus. It was short sighted. But it isn't fatal, and UConn isn't unique in that regard. Yes UConn is a young program, but one that actually was pretty successful in the Big East very quickly.

The second point is the one I raised earlier, which you griped about.
 
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If Purdue or WF or Washington State is in the P5 then we "deserve" to be P5 just the same..

If you downvote WF for being a small-ish private college, then...

Purdue (way)> WF > Washington State

I believe your Big Ten invite is just a matter of time. New England, along with another slice of NYC metro, is too academically and culturally rich to pass up.
 
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So UCLA isn't P5 worthy? Miami? Washington or Oregon? (technically off campus in both cases). Pitt? Baylor? USCe? I think it was a mistake to build the Rent off campus. It was short sighted. But it isn't fatal, and UConn isn't unique in that regard. Yes UConn is a young program, but one that actually was pretty successful in the Big East very quickly.

The second point is the one I raised earlier, which you griped about.
Washington and Oregon both play on campus or literally adjacent to it. UCLA and Miami aren't comparable to UConn's stadium situation since both play in other parts of their home city. That said, my point wasn't that it was fatal at all. It's just that it's another contributing factor to the perception of our program as second rate. There are loads of dominant college football programs that are located in obscure small towns not near any major highway or major town. It's entirely a perception thing with CR as we all know, and playing off campus is just another point against us in the perception game.
 
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Nope. The logic is silly. Louisville wasn't valuable enough one day, and then was the next? TCU? West Virginia?

One day Rutgers wasn't valuable enough for the B10, and the next day, poof, they are.

The truth to it is that there's a calculus to whether a team is worth adding that goes far beyond "value."
Its called the self licking ice cream cone. Once you're in it self perpetuates your "worthiness". Why? Because you're a member.
 
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This argument makes no sense and is nothing more than fluff/nonsense. Yes, there are several partnerships that have persisted throughout realignment (Wake in the ACC), but when adding new teams, it'a all about money. Any other way of thinking is delusional - which is exactly why we, as UConn fans, are always flustered when we are left out. We look at it from a different perspective.

We've been over this a thousand times. For anyone that has a network, UConn is valuable because of the number of TV sets and the very high monthly subscription fees that can be charged, and this makes UConn more valuable than Syracuse, BC, Pitt, Cincy, etc.
 
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How early were we considering moving to D1-A? Like when did the rumblings start?
First time I remember hearing it as a thought was in either '88 or '89. The AD at that time, Todd Turner, made a comment at a banquet that UConn was exploring upgrading football from 1AA to 1A.
 

HuskiesFan1014

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I do believe we are worthy of a P5, but none of that matters unless we are selected to join one. Expansion has been all about football, and thus money, and we just aren't there yet with football. That's been our problem - we weren't screwed by FSU & Clemson; we were screwed because we didn't have a big enough football program.
Wow. I finally understand. Thanks for opening up my eyes. It's not like this is a rehash of any of the million CR posts here. Truly original thought, at last. Finally it all makes sense.
 
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So UCLA isn't P5 worthy? Miami? Washington or Oregon? (technically off campus in both cases). Pitt? Baylor? USCe? I think it was a mistake to build the Rent off campus. It was short sighted. But it isn't fatal, and UConn isn't unique in that regard. Yes UConn is a young program, but one that actually was pretty successful in the Big East very quickly.

The second point is the one I raised earlier, which you griped about.

LOL. "Technically off campus" . C-mon man "technically off campus" and "45 miles away" are different. As it playing in a pro stadium. Get real.


I have pointed out how there is not a football program in the p-5 that is close to as young as UConn is. If you call that griping so be it. This is uncharted territory as most of the programs we know of who moved up from FCS to FBS recently are in conferences like the sun belt, not looking to in a p-5 conference like UConn is.
 
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Wow. I finally understand. Thanks for opening up my eyes. It's not like this is a rehash of any of the million CR posts here. Truly original thought, at last. Finally it all makes sense.
There's a reason this thread is entitled "Same old song and dance..." Did you actually expect a novel topic?
 
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Yeah, that was a part of it but I don't think it played an enormous role in the Louisville decision in the fall of 2012. That was so heavily predicated on football that P and the lack of success of the program post-Fiesta was far, far more important.
UConn had do many swings and misses in football it's really sad .
From the 50's onward UConn firmly established itself as Connrcticut's team in BB
Conversely UConn never established itself as Connrcticut's football team even yesrs after Yale faded from the picture. That was the first missed opportunity.
Even Delaware type success annually in a lesser division would have captured a state starved for college football. Winning seasons were rare even among lesser competition and successful programs like Southetn Conn got more press in some sections of the state than UConn. A low point was a loss to Div 11 New Haven.
Every time UConn football had a positive spin it was quickly followed by a bigger negative story.
We're going Big Time finally the state showed interest - the conference falls apart even before we join.
and the story becomes about lawsuits.
We win a championship and story is we lost money in a huge bowl game.
The bottom line is UConn never succeeded in capturing the love of their own state sometimes because of circumstances beyond their control. They don't have a big enough in state alumni base to sell out a BCS venue and beoming what they've attained in BB is the true ticket to success.
But one parting shot our record for the three seasons of the AAC is something like 7-16 , We were routed by Western Mich ,lost to a pathetic Army team and beat up by FCS Towson ,yet we continue to blame the AAC for fan apathy.
If we're were 16-7 in league play the last few years and beat up on the Cupcakes I strongly suspect the rent would be filled
 
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Enjoy the burning at the stake you're about to receive, newb.
joke
jōk/
noun
  1. 1.
    a thing that someone says to cause amusement or laughter, especially a story with a funny punchline.
    "she was in a mood to tell jokes"
    synonyms: funny story, jest, witticism, quip;


    I guess I still don't understand how this is a joke.
 

HuskiesFan1014

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joke
jōk/
noun
  1. 1.
    a thing that someone says to cause amusement or laughter, especially a story with a funny punchline.
    "she was in a mood to tell jokes"
    synonyms: funny story, jest, witticism, quip;


    I guess I still don't understand how this is a joke.
Then it's gonna be a very long ride for you in here.
 
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