Napheesa Collier should have been MVP, not A'ja Wilson...:) | Page 3 | The Boneyard

Napheesa Collier should have been MVP, not A'ja Wilson...:)

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DaddyChoc

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Overall, I found the U19 games much more enjoyable to watch than the Pan American games, despite the fact that my two absolute favorite players, Stewie and Moriah, were in Toronto. The U19s, whether dictated by rules or refs, played a much more flowing, uptempo style with an emphasis on skills and athleticism, whereas the Pan Am games was more often than not a punishing exercise in physicality, grabbing, hacking, and mauling and far less aesthetically pleasing to this fan.

Maybe because I'm accustomed to the US college game and not international women's play, or maybe because teams like Cuba, Brazil et al. resorted to non-stop bruising and roughhousing to compete since they were unable (mostly) to match the much younger Americans skills-wise. Either way, I found the product on the court in Toronto was less about entertaining basketball and more about survive and advance. Literally.
19 yr olds have a lot of energy, it was almost like they were trying out... The PanAm games had vets who are use to posting up and banging on picks and position. Almost like watching HS vs College vs Pros... different styles
 

UcMiami

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What I'm about to say may be totally off base and unfair, because USA U - coaches are given an impossible task: taking a bunch of talent and turning it into a team in 3-4 weeks. But, what I noticed in the last 2 games was how much the team looked like Staley's college team, both strengths and limitations. Very good D and a whole lot of stilted offense. If I was on the committee picking the next USA prime time players coach after Geno it would not be Staley.
I think part of the issue with the U19 team was the no-shows. If Durr and Lou had been available I think they would have gotten a lot of minutes and would have shot well from outside - hard to fault a coach with playing to their strength when the outside shooting was missing.

Triad - absolutely though your Asura had a great game and a really good tournament and she was instrumental in getting USA going in the final.

Loved Collier's game but I was surprised in the final on defense - there were a couple of one on one situations where the Russian player just blew right past her with her barely moving. She had lots of steals and generally played well, but those were very surprising to me.

Thought the reffing in the U19 was far superior to the PanAms and the games were a lot less physical - still international ball, but more like the Olympics and Worlds and not the slugfest that was Canada.
 
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A'ja was the main factor US beat Russia. Well deserving of MVP
Sometimes the BODY of work means more than just one game, albeit the championship game. Maybe without Pheese, the USA doesn't get to play for the championship and A'ja isn't playing against Russia! Throughout the tournament, Pheese was exceptional! It seems that A'ja had an exceptional championship game but does that suggest she should have been the MVP???? It's not like Pheese was chopped liver in the championship game, coming up with a double double!
 

triaddukefan

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Sometimes the BODY of work means more than just one game, albeit the championship game. Maybe without Pheese, the USA doesn't get to play for the championship and A'ja isn't playing against Russia! Throughout the tournament, Pheese was exceptional! It seems that A'ja had an exceptional championship game but does that suggest she should have been the MVP???? It's not like Pheese was chopped liver in the championship game, coming up with a double double!

To be honest... the USA didnt have a close game until the championship. I guess the semis versus Spain was semi-close...
 
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Steven's isnt a big ? :confused:

Ok! Elsewhere I wrote that she was more than good. Liked her play and compared her seemingly effortless/smooth style to that of Collier- so efficient at what they do. And, if Duke were to get Salvadore(sp)-- look out, a final 4 contender. So triaddukefan, there isn't much to coe after here, unless of course you want to parcel the gold from the dross.
 

triaddukefan

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Ok! Elsewhere I wrote that she was more than good. Liked her play and compared her seemingly effortless/smooth style to that of Collier- so efficient at what they do. And, if Duke were to get Salvadore(sp)-- look out, a final 4 contender. So triaddukefan, there isn't much to coe after here, unless of course you want to parcel the gold from the dross.

Question for you.... which front line would you rather have...... Collier, Stevens, Wilson.... or Stewart, Reimer, Coates ???? That Pan-Am/U-19 scrimmage would have been interesting to see.
 
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Question for you.... which front line would you rather have. Collier, Stevens, Wilson.... or Stewart, Reimer, Coates ???? That Pan-Am/U-19 scrimmage would have been interesting to see.

Good question - Wilson is better than Coates, Stevens is quicker and more versatile than Reimer. Of course, Stewie is the best. That's two of three for the U-19. Teamwork--that's close, but Reimer and Coates stood around too much and seemed plodding at times. Speed with size wins--I'll take the U-19.
 

CocoHusky

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Good question - Wilson is better than Coates, Stevens is quicker and more versatile than Reimer. Of course, Stewie is the best. That's two of three for the U-19. Teamwork--that's close, but Reimer and Coates stood around too much and seemed plodding at times. Speed with size wins--I'll take the U-19.
Agree with your analysis, just drawing a different conclusion. It is close so I picking the team with the best player which is clearly Stewie in both of our opinions.
 
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Agree with your analysis, just drawing a different conclusion. It is close so I picking the team with the best player which is clearly Stewie in both of our opinions.

Coco - we do think alike. My first impulse was to pick the PanAm team because Stewie is the best player, but I veered off and said--Give Stewie her points, the U-19 team has 2 other player who can dominate their opposition. Nevertheless, it is all conjecture and that's the fun of the BY. Thanks partner!
 
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Question for you.... which front line would you rather have. Collier, Stevens, Wilson.... or Stewart, Reimer, Coates ???? That Pan-Am/U-19 scrimmage would have been interesting to see.

Not exactly fair. My choice- if I'm allowed to pick- would be Stewart, Collier, Wilson and Stevens. Under press I'd go for Collier, Stevens and Wilson. The rational? Better div of labour among Collier et al., not sure that Stewart and co and blend into team play.
 

CocoHusky

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Not exactly fair. My choice- if I'm allowed to pick- would be Stewart, Collier, Wilson and Stevens. Under press I'd go for Collier, Stevens and Wilson. The rational? Better div of labour among Collier et al., not sure that Stewart and co and blend into team play.
I'm not sure a choice of Stewart, Collier, Wilson and Stevens was an option. I like it, but I believe this was to pick a threesome from two sets of players. But I suppose Wilson could play GUARD!
 
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View attachment 10071

This is what happens when you let the same guy who decided to turn off the AC just before the Russia vs USA game, also pick the MVP. Bad decisions... :rolleyes: USA's U-19 team wore down the Ruskies and took home the Gold Medal & A'ja Wilson was chosen MVP after scoring 30 points for the game & 128 for the tournament. For many UConn fans, the clear MVP was Napheesa Collier..!! :)

If the highest scorer is the MVP, then the trophy should go to Spain's Angela Salvadores, who scored 129 points to Wilson's 128. Salvadores is the high volume shooter who may or may not attend Duke. She had the misfortune of playing the USA 3 times in the past two weeks and shot an anemic 12-43 (28%). But heck, she scored 129 points in Russia and that seems to be all that counts. :mad:

1. Wilson (6'5") was out rebounded by Collier (6'1") 65 to 59. Take away all the offensive rebounds Wilson got from her own missed shots and it would have been far worse. :cool:
2. Wilson had 22 turnovers in just 7 games. New flash A'ja, you are NOT a point guard. You're not even a 2 guard. In sharp contrast, Napheesa had only 8 turnovers and CAN play the 2 guard. :D
3. Wilson took 103 shots and missed 52 of them. That's 49% on shots taken mostly from 3 feet from the basket. Collier shot 58.1% from inside the 3 pt arc. No contest.
4. Wilson is tall and gets fouled a lot. She missed 20 free throws and made only 56% from the charity stripe. Of course, Collier shot 80% from the free throw line.
5. Collier led the team in minutes played, steals, offensive rebounds, field goal %, free throw % and +/- efficiency. But Wilson scored more points. I guess that is what counts...:eek:
6. To be fair, Wilson also had more assists (16-14) and more blocked shots (8-5). And she scored 30 points in the final..!! Of course, she took 33 combines shots and free throws to do that...:( And the two big Ruskies she was helping cover scored 27 points.
7. Speaking of scoring points... Collier finished 2nd with 89 points on just 82 combined shots (72) and free throws (10).
8. Napheesa didn't score 30 pts in the final, but she did score 24 pts in the semi-final. Against the Russians, Collier had a double-double (10 pts & 10 rebounds), 3 assists and 6 steals.
9. Coach Staley decided to play Collier 169 minutes in this tournament. That was the most minutes of ANY player, including A'ja Wilson. Some people think you play the best player the most minutes. I do. :cool:
10. Wilson is a very good player, and no doubt the 2nd best player at the tournament. :)

I make no pretense at being unbiased when it comes to UConn players, but IMO Napheesa Collier was the MVP of the U-19 team that won the Gold in Russia. :)

Go Napheesa..!!
Go Huskies..!!

While I appreciate David's compelling argument regarding Napheesa Collier and the MVP award, this is one discussion I find hard to get too excited about. It's not that this isn't a valid debate to take a position on, it's just that I'm just too excited and focused on what a wonderful player will be joining our team. Napheesa is the real deal. And her off the court demeanor will make her a fan favorite for years to come. In fact, I strongly suspect that she would happily see A'ja Wwilson get the accolades here. She knows what she accomplished. We're getting a great athlete, a great competitor, a great finisher, a great teammate and a great person. I went to sleep with a smile on my face the other night.
 

huskyharry

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Napheesa had an amazing tournament, can't wait to see her in a UConn uniform!
 
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I hateeeee I didn't get a chance to see Collier play in this tournament!!! I've always said Collier is the #1 player in the 2015 class.....hands down!
That means we have 1A and 1B in which ever order you choose, and I'm just fine with that!
 

DaddyChoc

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MoJett vs Dangerfield kinda sway things in PanAm's favor
 
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While I agree completely with your sprited defense, it is far too logical & thoughtful. Plain and simple, the MVP goes to the player who scores the most points in the Championship Game. For this game it was Wilson. Last year it was Salvadores (who was on the losing team). The Pheenom had a wonderful tournament as did Wilson & Salvadores. The MVP had USA across her uniform and a gold medal around her neck-good enought for me to applaud her effort. Now when this MVP switches back to her Crimson and Black uniform that will be a different story.
Then why did Stewart get MOP in NC game with 8 points.Moriah should have received it.Staley won MOP in 1991 because she was the best player on the floor.Tennessee won the championship.
 

CocoHusky

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Then why did Stewart get MOP in NC game with 8 points.Moriah should have received it.Staley won MOP in 1991 because she was the best player on the floor.Tennessee won the championship.
I have no idea what you are talking about. What I/We were talking about is the FIBA U19 Championship game form July 2015 and the FIBA U17 game from July 2014. Neither of which had anything to do with how the NCAA determines the MOP.
 
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I don't think the committee would have a problem with her 20-0 record as coach of team USA. Actually she should be tops on the list to replace Geno.
They had Geno as a asst. for Donovan before he became the HC and IMO Dawn will be next in line when he steps down.
 

msf22b

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Broadway-
If Collier is the 5th or 6th or 7th best player on the team in November--my head starts spinning. .

My outrageous prediction...3 or 4 way tie for 5th.
With Ms C right up there.
 
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I have no idea what you are talking about. What I/We were talking about is the FIBA U19 Championship game form July 2015 and the FIBA U17 game from July 2014. Neither of which had anything to do with how the NCAA determines the MOP.
Collier should have won the MVP and just like Moriah they played great in all phases of their game.Wilson scored 30 and I will give her that but MVP no way.Nobody should get MVP just because they score the most points.That was my POINT.
 

CocoHusky

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Collier should have won the MVP and just like Moriah they played great in all phases of their game.Wilson scored 30 and I will give her that but MVP no way.Nobody should get MVP just because they score the most points.That was my POINT.
And clearly you missed mine. "Nobody should get MVP just because they score the most points." = your opinion. Salvadores & Wilson scored the most points and were named MVPs in consecutive years= verifiable fact.
 

triaddukefan

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And clearly you missed mine. "Nobody should get MVP just because they score the most points." = your opinion. Salvadores & Wilson scored the most points and were named MVPs in consecutive years= verifiable fact.

Well Salvadores definitely deserved to be MVP last year even though her team lost. ;)
 
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Maybe "incoming" freshman.

RISING freshmen are those on campus who A rise, some even before classes. Terrible term too often used too badly used for a person who may never achieve anything.

Collier is a talented Freshman who has shown she can play exceptionally well against older, more experienced players. I saw her knocked down and at that time she WAS a RISING Freshman, with vengeance in her eyes..
 
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And clearly you missed mine. "Nobody should get MVP just because they score the most points." = your opinion. Salvadores & Wilson scored the most points and were named MVPs in consecutive years= verifiable fact.
MVP/MOP should be given to the player who was beyond instrumental in getting their team to be victorious--whether that team wins it all or not. My MVP/MOP for the NCAA was Jefferson, for the Pan Am games--Nurse (runner up Jefferson), U19 Collier with Dangerfield runner up. It's not ONE game--it's how they contributed in most games (even a player who as a single bad game).
 
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