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dayooper

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GT AD Mike Bobinski on Atlanta radio and my proposal for making an ACC Net

He was asked point blank the following question:

"The SEC network is now huge and the Big 10 network has emerged from some lean years at the beginning to a major revenue addition to that league. There are even reports now that the Longhorn Network may earn a profit in the near future. Where is the ACC Network? What is the timeline for a network coming online?"

Bobinski's answer: The league is studying the issue and you should reserve your questions to Mr. Swofford."

Chuck Oliver (680 The Fan ATL): So you have nothing to say?

Bobkinski: As I stated, all questions on this subject need to go to Mr. Swofford.


Me: This guy doesn't sound happy about not having an ACCN.

Link
 

MattMang23

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Aww. Seems to be a little trouble in paradise. So sad.
 
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GT AD Mike Bobinski on Atlanta radio and my proposal for making an ACC Net

He was asked point blank the following question:

"The SEC network is now huge and the Big 10 network has emerged from some lean years at the beginning to a major revenue addition to that league. There are even reports now that the Longhorn Network may earn a profit in the near future. Where is the ACC Network? What is the timeline for a network coming online?"

Bobinski's answer: The league is studying the issue and you should reserve your questions to Mr. Swofford."

Chuck Oliver (680 The Fan ATL): So you have nothing to say?

Bobkinski: As I stated, all questions on this subject need to go to Mr. Swofford.


Me: This guy doesn't sound happy about not having an ACCN.

Link
Maybe ALL of the dude's ramblings aren't based on pure fantasy. He has been saying GT and FSU are very frustrated with the lack of an ACCN.
 
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Of the little three conferences all that is need is for Pac 12 to complain.

It's a SEC and Big 10 world and all other a conferences are playing catch-up (More like Ketchup)
 
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John Swofford is the Bernie Madoff of P5 commissioners...awesome at "taking in" teams but cannot produce a competitive profit against the SEC/BIG/PAC...no ACCN means no ACC in the long term (at least not with the ACC teams that have options)
 
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People, when they talk about money driving things, don't always look at the whole picture. Media money makes up about 25-40% of total athletic department income. At FSU, ESPN money about 25% of total.

Right now, there are five Big Ten teams with less total athletic revenue than FSU including Michigan State.

In the Big 12, there are teams like Texas and Oklahoma that make tens of millions more per year in athletic revenue than other Big 12 teams. Oklahoma makes $50 million per year and Texas $70 million more than WVU, as an example.

You could double media money and ACC schools (as well as schools like WVU, Texas Tech, Kansas, etc) would not compete in athletic department revenue with Ohio State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Texas, Alabama, etc.

It's nice to have some extra millions, but for a program like FSU, it may not have the impact that some think. FSU already has one of the highest paid assistant staffs in the country (higher than Texas, Ohio State, Michigan State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Florida, etc and the coach is #5 in pay. The facilities, new IPF, new dorm, $85 million improvement to stadium, new player lounge, locker room...all keep the program "current".

Sam Werner, Pitt AD, said January 16, that he thought progress was being made on the ACCN and that it was "on the horizon". I think that the industry is changing very quickly and that the parties are having to recalibrate within that context, but that live sports programming is still profitable and ESPN will make a buck if it is possible

And the ACC has content.

But that is only Billy's opinion.
 

Fishy

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It's on the horizon in the same way that the end of the world is on the horizon.

For the 300th time, the ACC is not getting a network. The working footprint of the conference simply isn't big enough.

The rights deal was never structured in a way that would be favorable to a network and the working documents passed around prior to the grant of rights were a work of fiction.
 
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People, when they talk about money driving things, don't always look at the whole picture. Media money makes up about 25-40% of total athletic department income. At FSU, ESPN money about 25% of total.

Right now, there are five Big Ten teams with less total athletic revenue than FSU including Michigan State.

In the Big 12, there are teams like Texas and Oklahoma that make tens of millions more per year in athletic revenue than other Big 12 teams. Oklahoma makes $50 million per year and Texas $70 million more than WVU, as an example.

You could double media money and ACC schools (as well as schools like WVU, Texas Tech, Kansas, etc) would not compete in athletic department revenue with Ohio State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Texas, Alabama, etc.

It's nice to have some extra millions, but for a program like FSU, it may not have the impact that some think. FSU already has one of the highest paid assistant staffs in the country (higher than Texas, Ohio State, Michigan State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Florida, etc and the coach is #5 in pay. The facilities, new IPF, new dorm, $85 million improvement to stadium, new player lounge, locker room...all keep the program "current".

Sam Werner, Pitt AD, said January 16, that he thought progress was being made on the ACCN and that it was "on the horizon". I think that the industry is changing very quickly and that the parties are having to recalibrate within that context, but that live sports programming is still profitable and ESPN will make a buck if it is possible

And the ACC has content.

But that is only Billy's opinion.

The ACC has content. But could use more.
 

UConn Dan

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It's on the horizon in the same way that the end of the world is on the horizon.

For the 300th time, the ACC is not getting a network. The working footprint of the conference simply isn't big enough.

The rights deal was never structured in a way that would be favorable to a network and the working documents passed around prior to the grant of rights were a work of fiction.
Worse than fiction, bush league.
 
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The ACC can only say "the check is in the mail" for so long. If Swofford can't produce an ACCN as promised, his "clients" will start fleeing.

There are 5 BIG teams which make less than FSU? Only 5? FSU has arguably been the most successful football team in America the past few years. The fact 7 BIG teams are outearning them is laughable.

All the P5 conferences are rich but it's an arms race. If big football ACC schools can make another $15 million somewhere else they will..."need" has nothing to do with it. $15 million is a new smoothy bar at the FSU's football players gym...trust me Bama is building one and that 5 star DE recruit loves smoothies
 

whaler11

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It's on the horizon in the same way that the end of the world is on the horizon.

For the 300th time, the ACC is not getting a network. The working footprint of the conference simply isn't big enough.

The rights deal was never structured in a way that would be favorable to a network and the working documents passed around prior to the grant of rights were a work of fiction.

It almost makes you wonder how this is clear to dozens of people on a message board but it seems to be a mystery to university adminstrators.
 

Fishy

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It almost makes you wonder how this is clear to dozens of people on a message board but it seems to be a mystery to university adminstrators.

They know - if it were actually coming, they'd be shouting it from the rooftops.

I did some googling and I found this map that consultants provided to the ACC to help illustrate the problem.

It turns out that there just isn't any place to sell the ACC Network. You really start to see the problems they're facing...

ACC_Markets.jpg
 

whaler11

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They know - if it were actually coming, they'd be shouting it from the rooftops.

I did some googling and I found this map that consultants provided to the ACC to help illustrate the problem.

It turns out that there just isn't any place to sell the ACC Network. You really start to see the problems they're facing...

ACC_Markets.jpg

I know they know it's not coming now - but at least some of them seemed to believe it was coming then.
 
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And the ACC has content.

Problem is, the ACC can only claim Virginia and North Carolina as "home" states, and much of the ACC's content is already allocated to Tier 1, the lesser ESPN's, Raycom and regional Fox . But wait, there's less: You also must subtract the Notre Dame home football games.

ETA: See Exhibit A - the Fishy map
 
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They know - if it were actually coming, they'd be shouting it from the rooftops.

I did some googling and I found this map that consultants provided to the ACC to help illustrate the problem.

It turns out that there just isn't any place to sell the ACC Network. You really start to see the problems they're facing...

ACC_Markets.jpg

Most of Pittsburgh? More like most of Oakland.
 

Fishy

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I know they know it's not coming now - but at least some of them seemed to believe it was coming then.

I think they thought there was an outside chance they could coerce ESPN into creating a channel for them or the ACC leaders did a good job of sugar-coating the problems.

The deal the conference signed was prohibitive to starting a network - they signed away content they needed to outlets like Raycom and FoxSportsNet in 2010 when they decided that they were not going to pursue a network of their own. (Raycom bought 30 football games and 60 basketball games - and then they sold some of that content to regional Fox outlets - those regional sports networks are not going to cut their own throats to sell content back to ESPN.)

When ESPN and the SEC signed their last deal, it was specifically structured to permit a conference network. The ACC's deal is almost perfectly structured to prohibit one - it's not specifically called for, the rights are not in place and the deal allows ESPN an easy out with a small bump in rights fees. ($3M per school is the amount bandied about - it's not that high. It's closer to $1M to $1.5M.)

The fact that they're failing is not really a surprise - there were plenty of media outlets laying out the problems right around the time of the GOR.
 

whaler11

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I think they thought there was an outside chance they could coerce ESPN into creating a channel for them or the ACC leaders did a good job of sugar-coating the problems.

The deal the conference signed was prohibitive to starting a network - they signed away content they needed to outlets like Raycom and FoxSportsNet in 2010 when they decided that they were not going to pursue a network of their own. (Raycom bought 30 football games and 60 basketball games - and then they sold some of that content to regional Fox outlets - those regional sports networks are not going to cut their own throats to sell content back to ESPN.)

When ESPN and the SEC signed their last deal, it was specifically structured to permit a conference network. The ACC's deal is almost perfectly structured to prohibit one - it's not specifically called for, the rights are not in place and the deal allows ESPN an easy out with a small bump in rights fees. ($3M per school is the amount bandied about - it's not that high. It's closer to $1M to $1.5M.)

The fact that they're failing is not really a surprise - there were plenty of media outlets laying out the problems right around the time of the GOR.

The Raycom deal seemed to make the concept impossible. I don't get how they possibly talked around that - especially with Swofford's relationship with Raycom.

I still don't know if anyone will try to bail soon - the last two seasons have made clear the advantage that Clemson and FSU have - which was why I never thought they would even be interested in the Big 12.

Maybe Georgia Tech would make a leap - I don't know if North Carolina would choose to give up their alpha position until they have to.
 

Fishy

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I think Florida State and Clemson would leave if the chance arose.

The question is where? We know FSU angled to get into the SEC and were refused. (Imagine how insane the SEC money printing press must be if they can look at Florida State and say, "Nope, those guys don't add to the haul.") Neither school can go to the Big Ten for a variety of reasons - academics, AAU, geography - whatever. Conversely, I don't think either school has any interest in the Big 12 or they'd already be there.

So they're stuck.

Boston College, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Wake Forest, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State and Louisville can't be first-movers, so they're stuck. Duke is in a weird category of its own.

So UNC, Georgia Tech and Virginia.

Someone would have to break one of those three off and that would likely create enough panic for the Big Ten and SEC to top off their membership. I don't know if that will happen, but in 2025, if the ACC is still in the $18-19M range and Big Ten/SEC schools are making 2.5x that, human history suggests that someone will jump.
 

whaler11

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I think Florida State and Clemson would leave if the chance arose.

The question is where? We know FSU angled to get into the SEC and were refused. (Imagine how insane the SEC money printing press must be if they can look at Florida State and say, "Nope, those guys don't add to the haul.") Neither school can go to the Big Ten for a variety of reasons - academics, AAU, geography - whatever. Conversely, I don't think either school has any interest in the Big 12 or they'd already be there.

So they're stuck.

Boston College, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Wake Forest, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State and Louisville can't be first-movers, so they're stuck. Duke is in a weird category of its own.

So UNC, Georgia Tech and Virginia.

Someone would have to break one of those three off and that would likely create enough panic for the Big Ten and SEC to top off their membership. I don't know if that will happen, but in 2025, if the ACC is still in the $18-19M range and Big Ten/SEC schools are making 2.5x that, human history suggests that someone will jump.

Yes Clemson or Florida State would join the SEC or Big 10. I was talking about reasonable scenarios.

If we are talking about 8-10 years from now... the possibility exists that none of these media properties will have figured out a way to generate enough revenue to make these sized contracts viable.

The entire sports infrastructure is built on ESPN generating 6-7 billion annually in affiliate money by having 60-70 million subscribers who never turn the station on.

If we end up in a true a la carte world - why would schools even write media contracts at the conference level.

The Longhorn network is a debacle today but ten years from now it might be the online model used by two dozen schools - while everyone else is scrambling to get two quarters to rub together.

It would seem a lot easier to me to get 200k people to buy a subscription to a single team than it would be to find 12 teams that generate 2.4 million subs to get everyone to the same revenue.

And if you could generate 500k - why would you pool your money with a Wake Forest who couldn't get 50k?
 

Fishy

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I don't think that's too far-fetched a scenario given that there are currently people making millions a year playing video games on YouTube.

Maybe not in five or ten years, but I can definitely see a day where even a school like UConn says f--- it and puts their home content on their own platform.

You think 100,000 people would spend $9.95 a month if that's what it took to see UConn home games in every sport?

Probably.
 
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I think Florida State and Clemson would leave if the chance arose.

The question is where? We know FSU angled to get into the SEC and were refused. (Imagine how insane the SEC money printing press must be if they can look at Florida State and say, "Nope, those guys don't add to the haul.") Neither school can go to the Big Ten for a variety of reasons - academics, AAU, geography - whatever. Conversely, I don't think either school has any interest in the Big 12 or they'd already be there.

So they're stuck.

Boston College, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Wake Forest, Virginia Tech, North Carolina State and Louisville can't be first-movers, so they're stuck. Duke is in a weird category of its own.

So UNC, Georgia Tech and Virginia.

Someone would have to break one of those three off and that would likely create enough panic for the Big Ten and SEC to top off their membership. I don't know if that will happen, but in 2025, if the ACC is still in the $18-19M range and Big Ten/SEC schools are making 2.5x that, human history suggests that someone will jump.
Completely agree with your assessment although I think VT might be a prime sought after team for the SEC.

Regardless it seems less likely the BIG/SEC launching a raid on the ACC prior to the GORs expiring. They are both making huge bank and do not need an emergency add now. Eventually those desired ACC programs will come to them in 2025.

The ACC has been protected by the lack of a 3rd east of the Mississippi conference with a network If the B12 were to somehow get it built....stand by (that is a huge "if" but still) The attraction of the Big12 network will be further multiplied as John Swofford allegedly promised an ACCN and still is not coming clean that it ain't happening.

Chris Rock famously once said in a standup routine "a man is only as faithful as his opportunities ." If FSU/Clemson get new opportunities with a B12 network...
 

nelsonmuntz

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Yes Clemson or Florida State would join the SEC or Big 10. I was talking about reasonable scenarios.

If we are talking about 8-10 years from now... the possibility exists that none of these media properties will have figured out a way to generate enough revenue to make these sized contracts viable.

The entire sports infrastructure is built on ESPN generating 6-7 billion annually in affiliate money by having 60-70 million subscribers who never turn the station on.

If we end up in a true a la carte world - why would schools even write media contracts at the conference level.

The Longhorn network is a debacle today but ten years from now it might be the online model used by two dozen schools - while everyone else is scrambling to get two quarters to rub together.

It would seem a lot easier to me to get 200k people to buy a subscription to a single team than it would be to find 12 teams that generate 2.4 million subs to get everyone to the same revenue.

And if you could generate 500k - why would you pool your money with a Wake Forest who couldn't get 50k?

I think this is where college athletics is going, and the only reason to share any of the money is going to be it will cost something to have a schedule, but it won't justify sharing all the revenue with networks or even conference networks.
 
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I think Florida State and Clemson would leave if the chance arose.

The question is where? We know FSU angled to get into the SEC and were refused. (Imagine how insane the SEC money printing press must be if they can look at Florida State and say, "Nope, those guys don't add to the haul.") Neither school can go to the Big Ten for a variety of reasons - academics, AAU, geography - whatever. Conversely, I don't think either school has any interest in the Big 12 or they'd already be there.

So they're stuck.

How is FSU stuck? According to Frank the Tank: "Florida State hits virtually every metric that the Big Ten is looking for long-term; football power, growing population and massive TV markets."
 
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Completely agree with your assessment although I think VT might be a prime sought after team for the SEC.

Regardless it seems less likely the BIG/SEC launching a raid on the ACC prior to the GORs expiring. They are both making huge bank and do not need an emergency add now. Eventually those desired ACC programs will come to them in 2025.

The ACC has been protected by the lack of a 3rd east of the Mississippi conference with a network If the B12 were to somehow get it built....stand by (that is a huge "if" but still) The attraction of the Big12 network will be further multiplied as John Swofford allegedly promised an ACCN and still is not coming clean that it ain't happening.

Chris Rock famously once said in a standup routine "a man is only as faithful as his opportunities ." If FSU/Clemson get new opportunities with a B12 network...

IF the LHN can be converted into the B12n, it's gives the B12 a significant advantage over the ACC. The infrastructure has been built and there will be no need for significant startup costs. The other advantage is time to market. Let's hope the B12 understands the advantage and executes.
 
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