ACC

[ZooCougar]

On one hand, you make a good point, but on the other, it was a tremendous smackdown of a guy who is still reveling in the Shane Stafford years like they meant a damn thing.

You just wait, five years from now we'll basking in the glow of what RG3 said about the Rent.

 

[ZooCougar]

I think Chip has returned.

 

[FromTheInside]

Anybody actually believe this guy?? Lol @ him listing off his creds on an internet message board like we should listen

Ok, so.........let's say someone who has a great deal of expertise in a subject happens upon a thread and wants to offer some insight. How exactly should he present said insight so that it is not taken with a grain of sand? It is beyond illogical to think I just showed up on a UConn board and decided to invent a character, some how educated myself on topics that would be impossible for me to know as an outside, then waste hours trying to build up internet cred on a message board I don't plan on sticking around on. I'm not a UConn grad or fan, and have never even watched a UConn football game. I just saw a thread and wanted to offer some insight. How do you think I know what I know? I'm not Carl. What I write not only is sensible, but is commentary that is impossible to know w/o actually being in the TV/sports world. If you'd like to think I'm some sort of drive by imposter, then that's fine.

You guys have a great board here & a lot of college spirit. But, some would rather start pissing matches than intelligently discuss a subject that has a great deal of bearing on UConn. Best of luck to you guys......and congrats on yesterday's b-ball win.

 

[Dann]

wow you must be either
a-bcu fan
b-cuse fan
c-carl
d-#notbegharder

 

[Carl Spackler]

How is that going to change? I don't even get NBC Sports on my expanded cable lineup. Once ESPN has no more interest in the Big East, they won't even talk about the league anymore. I don't see how any of this ends well for the Big East.

What makes you think that ESPN is not interested in the Big East? You think ESPN is not interested in Notre Dame? Depending on what report you read, they were willing to pay quite a bit for it with Syracuse and Pitt and WVU markets...........and what we will have going forward, market wise, will be a lot better than what we had before.

It's up to the athletic departments to go out and be competitive, but if you've followed Big EAst football at all, even in just the short time that UConn has been a 1-A program, the Big EAst, clearly has a signficiant track record of being able to elevate football programs to national recognition in short order on the backbone of that basketball league that was created 32 years ago.

 

[Adios]

Ok, so.........let's say someone who has a great deal of expertise in a subject happens upon a thread and wants to offer some insight. How exactly should he present said insight so that it is not taken with a grain of sand? It is beyond illogical to think I just showed up on a UConn board and decided to invent a character, some how educated myself on topics that would be impossible for me to know as an outside, then waste hours trying to build up internet cred on a message board I don't plan on sticking around on. I'm not a UConn grad or fan, and have never even watched a UConn football game. I just saw a thread and wanted to offer some insight. How do you think I know what I know? I'm not Carl. What I write not only is sensible, but is commentary that is impossible to know w/o actually being in the TV/sports world. If you'd like to think I'm some sort of drive by imposter, then that's fine.

You guys have a great board here & a lot of college spirit. But, some would rather start pissing matches than intelligently discuss a subject that has a great deal of bearing on UConn. Best of luck to you guys......and congrats on yesterday's b-ball win.

Thank you for sharing your insight. UConn b-ball has to be watched by SOME people outside of this area. 3 championships = bandwagon following.

We lost yesterday, by the way.

 

[Carl Spackler]

FWIW - FromTheInside.....when I first started writing on this website a while back now, I was repeatedly accused of being a parent or relative of a player. I found it trully bizarre. But, well, the internet is a whole new world of communication.

I wrote that I don't trust you, and not to take it personal. I saw inconsistency in your conclusions, especially about Notre Dame, and regardless, I never trust anything numerical or statistical, or basically anything presented as fact, without questioning it and digging for some kind of references to support whatever it happens to be.

If you are trully interested in UConn athletics, and have come here, weather the storm. I was defending myself about not being a parent of a current player for quite some time before people figured out that wasn't the case. Very odd. I suppose that there had been previous experiences among writers to lead to that conclusion.

But asking for references based on stuff you're presenting as facts, is a pretty basic thing around here.

 

[FromTheInside]

wow you must be either
a-bcu fan
b-cuse fan
c-carl
d-#notbegharder

Texas grad (fan), UCLA JD/MBA (not a fan). Avidly follow Texas, Florida State & Ole Miss, casually follow GA Tech, Clemson, Miami, Georgia, and Notre Dame (i.e. check the box scores & catch a game or two a year).

 

[businesslawyer]

Texas grad (fan), UCLA JD/MBA (not a fan). Avidly follow Texas, Florida State & Ole Miss, casually follow GA Tech, Clemson, Miami, Georgia, and Notre Dame (i.e. check the box scores & catch a game or two a year).

LIke we needed another lawyer around here.

 

[uconnbaseball]

I think Chip has returned.

I don't see it, and my Chip detector works very well. Stick around FTI...if you desire.

 

[businesslawyer]

I think Chip has returned.

No. His posts were way, way, way too coherent. And he didn't say "I'm not Chip. Who is this chip."

 

[Adios]

LIke we needed another lawyer around here.

We need you two to go at each other's necks.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Did all of my insight suddenly disappear b/c I backhanded a self-aggrandizing poster who elevates his nonsensical arguments above logic & reason, refusing to come to terms with the fact that he actually has absolutely no clue what he's talking about? Do you realize how absolutely illogical it is to presume that a non-UConn guy would suddenly appear on the board and try to gain some sort of e-cred by pretending he's some sort of insider? What the heck am I going to do with e-cred from a UConn board? Seriously. I can't convert it into food, beer, or money. It has no value. And thus, I'm not going to waste my time for something that has no value. Simple fact is, I like talking realignment. I happened to see this thread in a search I did on Google and decided to join in and chat for a bit. Once the conversation is gone, I'll be gone. I just stopped by to say "hi", share a little insight, and enjoy some discussions w/ some UConn fans. Nothing more, nothing less.

Didn't see this before. I tend to get long winded on Fridays and then have to go back and read. As noted a long time ago in this discussion, I'd love to see some references as to the viewership numbers and market shares and broadcast dollars in contracts stuff that you've noted.

P.S. I think what you can probably glean from all of this, is that UConn people around here consider UConn serious business and put new meaning into the term 'fanatic' that the word fan is derived from.

 

[FromTheInside]

LIke we needed another lawyer around here.

Nah, I just thought I wanted to be a lawyer. Realized pretty quickly that I hate reading boring stuff! Ended up working for one of the Big 5 conferences, then when the TV contracts came around, realized how much I really enjoyed the research, numbers, and analytics. So, I parlayed that into a job working for the company that helps networks, colleges, conferences, sports, leagues, etc value athletic entertainment. I love it. I eat, sleep, breathe the analytical side of sports.

 

[Kevin Caliendo]

The question should be...what is a division of the ACC that includes BC, syracuse, Pitt, Uconn, ND, MD and VA/VTech worth?

 

[FromTheInside]

so then i ask, how far away is uconn from bcu/pitt/cuse #'s wise???

They're not. All 4 are very similar in terms of value to a TV contract. The difference between BC, Pitt, and Syracuse is all 3 have a relationship with Notre Dame. UConn blew there's up. Were it UConn that scheduled a long series with Notre Dame instead of Syracuse, they absolutely would have taken Syracuse's spot in the ACC. Notre Dame didn't care who it was.......they just wanted to have a regular game in NYC against an opponent that generated some interest in the city. It could have been UConn, Rutgers, Syracuse, etc. But, UConn passed and Syracuse stepped in. Now, Syracuse is the ACC's latest Domer carrot. UConn actually out pulls Syracuse in NYC for football. It was a serious missed opportunity.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

They're not. All 4 are very similar in terms of value to a TV contract. The difference between BC, Pitt, and Syracuse is all 3 have a relationship with Notre Dame. UConn blew there's up. Were it UConn that scheduled a long series with Notre Dame instead of Syracuse, they absolutely would have taken Syracuse's spot in the ACC. Notre Dame didn't care who it was.......they just wanted to have a regular game in NYC against an opponent that generated some interest in the city. It could have been UConn, Rutgers, Syracuse, etc. But, UConn passed and Syracuse stepped in. Now, Syracuse is the ACC's latest Domer carrot. UConn actually out pulls Syracuse in NYC for football. It was a serious missed opportunity.

God damnit. I knew this was going to come back and bite us in the ass.

The people that thought that UConn and all of it's 10 years of FBS competition were suddenly above playing ND at a neutral location had absolutely no foresight into the ramifications that would have for our program.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Great question. There are a handful of dynamics in play with regards to an FSU/Clemson move to the Big XII. First, the Big XII’s current ABC/ESPN contract is 5 years old. It was signed 1.5 years before it took effect, and runs for another 4 seasons. So, the valuation is old. Think of it like the housing market. If you buy a house in 2012 for $200k, and do a kitchen & bathroom remodel, then sell it in 2020 for $300k………the remodel didn’t add 50% value to the house. It added “some” value, but most of it was added by appreciation/inflation. That’s how it is with the Big XII. If they added Florida & Clemson, there is a strong bump in the value of their TV contract. But, a large percentage of that value is in appreciation/inflation.

Right now, the Big XII is worth at least $20M…….possibly more. At the time the Big XII signed their last contract, in April 2007, Texas & OU were big dogs in college football, but the rest of the Big XII was horrible. Nebraska was on a downward slide, and had had multiple coaching controversies. Missouri, OK State, and A&M had been mediocre at best the entire previous contract. K-State had fallen off mightily, and Snyder was out the door. Kansas, Colorado, Iowa State, and Baylor were nobodies. Texas Tech had managed a slew of 8-9 win seasons, but hadn’t gotten over the hump. So, the Big XII’s 2007 valuation was based on Texas & OU’s high appeal, and the overall low appeal of all of the other schools, including Nebraska’s declining TV #s. This is why the losses of Nebraska, Colorado, Missouri, and A&M aren’t as bad as people think……..b/c they actually didn’t contribute much to the last TV contract, aside from regional appeal (which was middling at best for CU and MU).

In the Big XII today, you have Texas & OU both seen as major powers, Oklahoma State has surged into a perennial top 25 team, K-State surging back to respectability, Texas Tech has put together a number of very good teams, West Virginia & TCU, who’ve both had very strong TV #s and an equally impressive resume, are joining the conference, etc. The Big XII went from the #3-4 conference in college football in 2007 to the clear cut #2 conference today. So, even with the losses of teams, their additions and the dramatic improvement of their product, will result in a significant appreciation of value. Then on top of that, you add inflation, and you’ve got a conference that should be able to pull in $19M - $25M per team per year with their next contract.

Now, you add Florida State & Clemson to that. It is true that with either school (and that goes for all schools), you do not get “the whole state tuning in”. But, when non-subscription based contracts are written, they’re based on regional & national appeal (sets turned on). WHERE the TV sets are draw from impacts the value of the contract. TV sets turned on outside a team’s DMA or region have a greater impact on a TV contract than sets turned on in a team’s DMA or region. That’s b/c it allows the network to expand the footprint of the broadcast, which creates a diversity of viewers, which increases advertising prices during those telecasts. So, a team that has super strong regional appeal, but has minimal national appeal, would actually be worth less to an ABC or ESPN than would a team that mas minimal regional appeal, but strong national appeal. Examples of these would be Nebraska (former) & Miami (latter).

Both Florida State & Clemson have strong appeal outside their DMAs. Clemson actually pulls very well in Alabama, Georgia, Northern Florida, and parts of North Carolina & Tennessee. Florida State pulls well across all of the ACC states, plus most of the SEC, as well as in Texas and California. So, it’s not just about the size of the state the team is in. This is why teams like Notre Dame, USC, Texas, Florida State, Florida, Alabama, etc are so valuable, b/c when they’re playing, they turn on sets well outside their geographic region.

The other dynamic at play is that if the Big XII brings in 2 more teams, be they FSU & Clemson or others, they'll be able to reap the rewards of a conference championship game. And still further, the addition of 2 more teams opens back up the conference's Fox Sports contract, which is well undervalued, b/c it was signed in haste to raise the conference's payout to prevent further defections. Their FSN contract has a "fair market value" clause in it, which will allow the conference to get a fair market value if the contract is reopened. This clause is not present in the SEC or ACC's contracts, which is why they won't get the bump in payout that they would on an open market.

So, there are a number of factors at play, all which which combined, significantly impact the Big XII's ability to rake in monster dollars if they land the right combination of teams.

Again, didn't see this before when I was flying on the keyboard. That in bold, is exactly what I'm talking about, that the Big East has the opportunity to do what the NFL did. Create new viewers for it's football programs, from coast to coast.

The only way that happens, is by actually getting the games on nationally, and then being able to schedule as many as possible, such that the home team, is playing their game, in a primetime TV slot. As more local fans, start paying attention to other teams from far away, and the more that a closed league has meaningful games for a title, the more NEW VIEWERS are generated in NEW MARKETS.

You are absolutely correct, college football is stuck in a rut right now, that it's nearly impossible for the so called big boys, to generate new viewers. If you look at the past year, the regular season LSU Alabama game drew more viewers than the BCS game. They're actually losing viewers.

No other league out there has that ability right now, to generate new viewers, that the Big East does. If the MWC/CUSA merger happens, they will also have that opportunity.

The future of the big east absolutely, 100% hinges on the quality of this next broadcasting contract, and truthfully......cue twilight zone music.....I'm not very much concerned about the $ amounts......I'm more concerned about the structure of the contract and how the scheduling and desireable time slots are going to be handled and how many, and what games go out nationally vs. regionally.

With the reach the conference has from coast to coast, it would be a compelte failure to get some kind of regular national broadcasting of big east football games, and work it around Notre Dame broadcasts, either with the same broadcasting company that handled Notre Dame football, or with a different one. We'll see what happens, the big east is up for sale as of Sept. 1.

 

[FrostyNuggets]

They're not. All 4 are very similar in terms of value to a TV contract. The difference between BC, Pitt, and Syracuse is all 3 have a relationship with Notre Dame. UConn blew there's up. Were it UConn that scheduled a long series with Notre Dame instead of Syracuse, they absolutely would have taken Syracuse's spot in the ACC. Notre Dame didn't care who it was.......they just wanted to have a regular game in NYC against an opponent that generated some interest in the city. It could have been UConn, Rutgers, Syracuse, etc. But, UConn passed and Syracuse stepped in. Now, Syracuse is the ACC's latest Domer carrot. UConn actually out pulls Syracuse in NYC for football. It was a serious missed opportunity.

What is the end game for conf expansion? 4 major conferences? 14, 16, or 18 teams per conference, etc?

 

[businesslawyer]

God damnit. I knew this was going to come back and bite us in the ass.

The people that thought that UConn and all of it's 10 years of FBS competition were suddenly above playing ND at a neutral location had absolutely no foresight into the ramifications that would have for our program.

It wasn't lack of foresight. It was their need to feel important and powerful, as opposed to supporting the progression of the University's athletic programs.

 

[Carl Spackler]

They're not. All 4 are very similar in terms of value to a TV contract. The difference between BC, Pitt, and Syracuse is all 3 have a relationship with Notre Dame. UConn blew there's up. Were it UConn that scheduled a long series with Notre Dame instead of Syracuse, they absolutely would have taken Syracuse's spot in the ACC. Notre Dame didn't care who it was.......they just wanted to have a regular game in NYC against an opponent that generated some interest in the city. It could have been UConn, Rutgers, Syracuse, etc. But, UConn passed and Syracuse stepped in. Now, Syracuse is the ACC's latest Domer carrot. UConn actually out pulls Syracuse in NYC for football. It was a serious missed opportunity.

Great point. I was, and still am, against the scheduling of Notre Dame football games at a neutral site, without getting at least one game at our home stadium. It's my understanding, someone correct me if I'm wrong on this....that the UConn position (which was also the state legislature position) was that we were willing to play neutral sites, for at least one game at Rentschler field.

But you also reinforce my opinions of the ACC and their relationship with ESPN. ESPN simply wants Notre Dame, and the Big East conference, is in the way. It's a crappy situation for us in Connecticut. ESPN and Connecticut athletics, and the big east conference in general, while currently, have nothing really to do with each other than geographic proximity, and business contracts, have very deep, historic and personal ties - all three institutions - UConn, ESPN, and the Big East.

Believe it or not, one of the very first college football broadcasts on ESPN, was a UConn football game at the old Memorial Stadium. Less people probably watched it than were actually in the stands, but hey - it is what it is.

There are a lot of people in CT that feel completely betrayed by the current ESPN leadership.

 

[Carl Spackler]

It wasn't lack of foresight. It was their need to feel important and powerful, as opposed to supporting the progression of the University's athletic programs.

Ouch!!! Owwee! LOL.

 

[Carl Spackler]

What is the end game for conf expansion? 4 major conferences? 14, 16, or 18 teams per conference, etc?

It never ends, conference shifting, expansion, contraction, failure, new conference formation...... until there is a structured playoff for a national champion that involves all division 1-A conference champions.

The supreme court saw to that in 1984.

 

[MattMang23]

I really love your interest in UConn football, but you really need to take the time to comprehend all the stuff I'm writing.

HAHAHAHAHAHA. Who has the years to do that?

 

[ConnHuskBask]

It wasn't lack of foresight. It was their need to feel important and powerful, as opposed to supporting the progression of the University's athletic programs.

Two biggest days for exposure for UConn Football were the Notre Dame game and The Fiesta Bowl vs Oklahoma.

One we willingly stopped and now the other one (re: BCS) we may be locked out of when the new BCS contract is in place.

I should stop racking my brain over this stuff that I have no control of whatsoever, but god damn, I just can't.